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The Expanding Impact of Marketing with Sandra Lopez
May 17, 2022 Brand Leadership Business Growth Career Growth Creative Agency Design Leadership Digital Transformation Marketing Strategy
Guest Speaker

Sandra Lopez

General Manager, Global Marketing, Microsoft Advertising

Sandra Lopez is the General Manager of Global Marketing for Microsoft’s advertising business. She is also the co-chair of the World Economic Forum’s Global Future Council on VR, AR, and XR, and she currently serves as an advisor to Sports Integrity Global Alliance. She has received numerous recognitions throughout her career, including “Top Women in Sports” from AdWeek and “Top 100 Women in Technology” from Technology Magazine. She is focused on building the next generation of women leaders.

Marketing is establishing a relationship.

Business in today’s experience economy is about creating and maintaining a long-term connection between customer and brand. Just like any relationship, growing this kind of bond requires effort, commitment, and understanding. And that’s where marketing and creativity have to work hand in hand — to ensure customers that a brand’s values and social responsibilities reflect their own level of consciousness.

Join Sandra Lopez, General Manager of Global Marketing at Microsoft Advertising, in this episode of Real Creative Leadership to talk about today’s high-stakes marketing world — where brands need to position themselves around many different topics and understand how those positions reflect consumer mindsets.

Listen now to learn more about the many hats marketers wear today to help brands maintain relevance while also generating revenue.

Watch this episode to discover:

  • Where leaders can make cultural transformation happen
  • Which leadership conversations challenge societal norms
  • Why creatives are integral to boardrooms
  • How to level-up the role of marketing in organizations
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mentioned in this show:
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Adam Morgan
Creative Leader and RCL Host
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RCL Episode Season 3, Episode 5
Title: The expanding impact of marketing — with Sandra Lopez
General Manager, Global Marketing, Microsoft Advertising

 

OPENING QUOTE (around 36:25)

“I think there’s a massive opportunity for creative directors, CMOs, to be part of the BOD and help shape the company. You can represent the customer, you’re representing our population, and having that voice and kind of influencing the company to do better and to do good.”

 

Transcript

Adam Morgan (10:30)

Hello and welcome to this brand new episode of Real Creative Leadership. Today we’re exploring the changing roles of marketing, both in business and the culture at large. And we have a fantastic guest to help us dig into this topic: Sandra E. Lopez. 

She is the VP, GM, and CMO of Microsoft advertising business, where she’s focused on driving effective marketing, position business, and shared growth, as well as driving revenue. She’s a chair of World Economic Forum, Global Future Council on VR, AR, XR, and many other accolades. And I won’t go through the whole lengthy list, but we are just so excited to have Sandra on the show. So Sandra welcome. Thanks for joining us.

Sandra Lopez:

Glad to be here.

Adam Morgan:

Excellent. And we are going to dig into this hot topic. Digital transformation is huge and there’s all this talk of change. And clearly many of us have gone through the last two years, a lot of change. But we want to talk about a little bit more of where we think things are moving and how marketing is going to make a bigger impact on both culture and business.

But let’s start out first before we even get into all that. We need people to understand who you are and a little bit of your background. So if you can just give us a little taste on your role and how it brought to you to creativity and marketing, where you’ve been a little bit so that we have context of who you are.

Sandra Lopez:

Great, Adam. Well, I would like to say that I was born and raised as a Silicon baby, in the heart of Silicon Valley in the technology industry. And starting in the tech industry, I always had aspirations to be a chief marketing officer and so, in doing so I tried many different roles and had the opportunity to be both in marketing and business. And what I realized with regards to the world of marketing is that every single function — where you’re the CEO, CFO, chief people officer — you have the responsibility to be a marketer as well. And what I mean by that is that really understanding your customer and who you’re serving so that you create products and services that meet their needs or improve their lives. So I always like to say that, marketing is often seen as a cost center, but in reality, it plays a pivotal role in terms of the overall growth. And I always challenge whether you’re head of sales or head of HR, is that if we’re here to serve our stakeholders, which has our key constituents as our customers, we all have the responsibility to understand who they are. And so that’s really my curiosity in terms of the world of marketing. 

And in the spirit of creativity — I know, Adam, you’re head of creative — I also believe that we’re all creative, right? As little kids, we had to solve problems. Isn’t creativity just about problem solving and looking at the world from different lenses? And oftentimes I believe that society over time just boxes in that, because you draw well or because you’re doing the 30 second video content, you’re the creative person and everybody else is not. In reality, we are all creative creatures, and really embracing that so that we can innovate and create together, I think is an exciting opportunity. So I think I’m a creator at heart, really from the stem of what problems are we seeking to solve and how do we best solve them in a manner that understanding that most often times we have constraints that we have to work under?

Adam Morgan:

Oh, I’m so glad you brought that up. Even though that wasn’t necessarily part of our topic today, 100% agree. I mean, capital C creativity is what we all have, it’s like human ingenuity. I think that’s a big issue in business today, is that they feel like, “No, the creative people go over into that corner and you do your thing.” No, the reason why you’re on this show is because creative leadership isn’t limited to a creative director or head of creative, it’s people who believe that creativity can impact business and drive it forward. End of story. So, thank you for talking about that.

Sandra Lopez:

Yeah. No, absolutely.

Adam Morgan:

To dig a little bit more than this, because when we last talked, you talked about yes, that marketing is a growth engine not an expense, but you’ve also talked a little bit, just tell me just a little brief of your perspective of how it’s changed from the 1980s to today. Because we’re going to talk about not just that in marketing, but also how boards of directors are going to be changing, but give me some context on what it was like in the past and what it needs to be today.

Sandra Lopez:

Yeah, wow, we’re dating ourselves back, right? So when we were kids, what was it? You go back and you look at the history of advertising, and when I was growing up in the ’80s, I just remember really what the role and as I reflect back and understand where we’ve come from, was really to drive awareness. And arguably at that time, in my opinion, it was very transaction based, right? The notion of where marketing organizations, where they really talking about loyalty or relationship, I did not believe existed. And today the way I view marketing, how radically it has evolved. And this is why in my heart of hearts, I believe marketing is so strategic to the overall organization and deserving of a board of director seats, is that if you take a step back and think about our responsibility to the organization, it’s about establishing a relationship, right?

At the very beginning, we are required as marketers — there’s a group that’s really intended to woo, your customer. I always like to say, it’s like dating. You got to woo that particular prospect and really articulate your contributions in terms of how you’re going to make their life better. 

And then, you have to create a compelling reason. Time is our most precious commodity. So why should they be attracted to your brand? Or why should they be attracted to your business? And so that’s like you go the art of wooing and you’re dating and then how do you attract them? And then you have to think about the role of once you do have a customer and driving overall value and building that relationship. And I always talk about nurturing, right?

How are you going to grow that partnership and that relationship that you have with the customer so that they become committed to the relationship over a very long period of time. So, if you think about how many different hats we have to play, in the marketing organization. From bringing that new prospect in and increasing the overall user value and user growth, to increasing the over our share of wallet — to do that, you have to have such a strong understanding of your customer. And really leveraging all the tools you have to ultimately kind of, I keep on going and saying like, “It’s about growing.” And that’s why I always say, think about the marketing organizations or about growing and the evolution from what arguably was much more awareness above the line and transaction-based has really shifted to marketing as a growth engine, establishing relationships and nurturing relationships over a period of time.

Adam Morgan:

That’s fantastic. And I know that when we talked earlier, it’s like we have moved into this experience economy. And everything you just said about moving away from just engaging people or engaging customers, it’s now all about relationships. Those relationships are a big part of those interactions you have, those experiences you have the connective tissue, right. And so let’s talk a little bit more about exactly how marketing is playing a bigger role in all of that, in creating those experiences and why that’s such a critical component to differentiate your business. That’s no longer just about efficiency, but it’s about, what are you feeling and doing and experiencing together. And then how marketing teams now play a bigger role in everything from social justice to culture.

Sandra Lopez:

Yeah. I mean, I think to ground everything, oftentimes we talk about experiences. We go into whether a particular event and how the brand’s going to represent, let’s say Coachella. And what I would like to challenge our industry at large is you talked about social justice. And this is like this weekend, I was giving an example of because it’s a hot topic, right? So you’re hearing various different companies take a role on the hybrid work environment, right? It’s about the employees. What is your philosophy? Are you five days a week? Are you three days a week and two days? Are you giving your employees the true flexibility so that they can perform in giving the employees, empowering them to make the decision?

And what was really interesting as I was sitting next to a young kid who was a teenager, 17, and I asked him this question, I go, “If you learned about your favorite jean brand, and he mentioned it, was in the news and in the news, the company took a position that they want their employees all to work in the office. And the employees were disgruntled. Would you buy a pair of jeans? Yes or no.” And he is like, “No,” because he is like, “That’s kind of screwed up. They’re not giving the employees the flexibility. So I’m sure I can find an alternate pair of jeans.” 

I bring this up because as marketers, we now need to think about positions that we’re going to take around many different topics and how that is reflecting our brand. You talk about experiences like the brand and experience they’re giving to their employees. And as consumers we are observing everything. Is that brand aligning to our values? There’s so many options nowadays out there. There’s no longer one or two brands in a particular category. There is a plethora of brands and options that as consumers and individuals we can pick from.

So as you’re thinking about our role, what position are we going to take around the hybrid work environment? How is that going to affect us? And how is that going to affect your consumer set our position around the geopolitical climate. I never thought that I would be in a room talking about the geopolitical climate and context of a possible war that exists. 

I think we have so much more responsibility — not only as a growth engine, but shaping the culture of a company, we as marketing organizations and influencing policy. And so who would’ve thought marketing would be playing that to type of role, and now we are. And for many of us it’s new. Somebody’s like, “I’m an expert.” I’m like, “How can you be an expert?” COVID is something that we’ve never experienced. We’re on the largest global experiment in our world. Who would’ve thought, I didn’t think we were going to be in another war and providing a perspective.

This hybrid work environment didn’t exist before. So no, we’re not experts. We’re all learning from each other. And I think that’s the power of the collective we, and learning from, and having these type of conversations with you, Adam, so that you kind of take the best of the best and employ them within your organization. And so you can better serve your employees, your customers, and the world at large.

Adam Morgan:

I love all of that. And it’s fascinating to really think about how different the world is today. I mean, if you think, you brought up geopolitical and when we think of, okay, in the news, it’s not just, one country asking for help from another group of countries or from another one, but specifically calling out brands, just like Tesla when they were sending out some satellite equipment. We’re all watching, the world’s watching brands interact with geopolitical forces within tweets, right? We’re seeing it all come together in real time.

And that’s pretty amazing, but it really tells me there’s so much more, as you said, before these relationships. It’s because people band together with their tribes, right. And if your brand is part of a certain tribe, then you have to act as part of that and stand up for it and do whatever it is for, whether it’s hybrid work environments or it’s going to be Black Lives Matter rallies, whatever it may be, a marketing is so critical to all of that and driving what the brand stands for and what it’ll do and what how it will react in those relationships with customers. That’s just so-

Sandra Lopez:

I totally agree when I love the word that you use a tribe, because it kind of takes us back to caveman days right? Survival and communities and the importance of establishing a community. And in that spirit of you’re talking about your tribe, and who’s your tribe, you kind of have to take a step back and constantly check in with yourself, “Who are we as a brand? What values do we want to represent?” And decisions that you’re going to make, sometimes at the cost of profit? Like, what are you going to do? And so I do believe we’re entering in a completely different era in which humanity, empathy and the role of marketing, because I always think about marketers, we’re supposed to be, psychologists, sociologists, psychologists, understanding your persona, your customer set. There’s sociologists in terms of the broader society and anthropologists, really thinking and understanding what they are going through? And sometimes decisions are not for that extra dollar, but it’s for improving society.

And so I love what I do. And I think it’s such a fascinating time and kind of leading these conversations and challenging oneself to maybe do things differently, so that we do create a better society and challenge our business partners that obviously as a publicly traded company, you always, when are actively seeking revenue, growth, and profits, and the question is at what expense?

Adam Morgan:

Let’s dig in that a little bit more because you’re right. If these relationships are important, it’s no longer just about profit first, right. Relationships first. So tell us more about, because we talk about digital transformation and everyone says, “Oh, that’s just technology. We’re just talking about what new systems are you going to put in place to transform digitally? But you’ve had a different experience at Microsoft where it’s putting more of a focus on people. So tell us more about that, of bringing it back to the humanity and making that the first priority versus technology or whatever else.

Sandra Lopez: 

Yeah. I kind of have goosebumps because to be fair, I’m five months into Microsoft and I observed from the outside and really admired Microsoft’s journey from transformation and the culture revolution that they’re undergoing. And if we can learn, at least if I’m learning anything, is that you can mobilize people for a common good and watching what Microsoft has done in terms of the cultural transformation is pretty impressive. And so at the same time, when you think about your customers and your people, and if you have a clear mission and vision of what you’re trying to accomplish, you can also mobilize a broader community. And like you said, a broader tribe to move society forward. I think it’s having conviction and making sure that your words match your behavior. And I think Microsoft, at least from my observation, and I know a lot of companies going through transformation, but as I compare notes with various different colleagues at various different companies, because it’s digital, the technology’s an enabler.

It really goes back to like the human aspects, which I think is the whole irony of things. Technology is here to make the world better. It is the enabler, it’s not the only answer. So you use tools to be more efficient. You use the data to be more informed about your customers, so that you build greater products and services. Yet ultimately, any transformation starts at your leadership and the values in which you want to deploy, because you make decisions. You’re making decisions around data and how are you going to use data. You go back to what are your core values? What do you stand for? How do you protect consumer data? 

Satya says this all the time, “Data’s a human right.” And rightly so. If you start to think about these values or behaviors in which you want to live through, it’s interesting conversations that happen. So this notion that digital is technology and it’s all that tech thing — transformation is a strategy and where the company wants to go and you leverage technology so that you can get to that kind of strategy and vision. So if used correctly it could be one of your strategic weapons, because you’re able to move faster, more efficiently. You get the data to drive insights and informed decisions.

Adam Morgan:

That’s interesting. There are a lot of similarities between my company, Adobe, and yours, Microsoft, on that whole journey that you just described. Of making that whole what do we call it? The customer journey, the advertising. The whole process of starting with enabling people and empowering them and giving them the tools to be the stars.

And then throughout that whole process being like, here’s the data, here are the tools, here are the other elements you need along that whole thing to connect with your customers and make a better experience. So yeah, I think that’s spot on from my point of view as well.

Sandra Lopez:

Yeah. It’s hard. Technology isn’t easy. Yet, I always like to say fashion, music, art informs culture and society. Well now technology is informing culture and society, both in our personal and at work. How do you deploy it and know that technology is ever changing? Who would’ve thought? I always laugh, we’re trying to just figure out Web 2.0 and get our own datas and analytics and BI tools figured out, and then all of a sudden you have Web 3.0.

Adam Morgan:

Yep.

Sandra Lopez:

So it’s constant. It’s constant. And that goes to the role of marketing. You got to be in the forefront, and you got to try, and you got to learn things. You got to work with various people that are experts in their trade and be okay to try and fail. Because in many cases it’s going to be a first. It’s never been done before. But as people get like, okay we figured out Web 2.0. You’re like, nope you have Web 3.0. 3D spatial computing is on the horizon and what does it mean for your company. And how do you want to use it from a marketing perspective where it adds value and it’s not for gimmicky sake. Oftentimes we want to try things for the PR headline. You shouldn’t do that. You should do it for, well what’s in it going back to the relationship with your customer. Why am I going to go into a Web 3.0 world and what value is it going to bring to the customers that I’m serving?

Adam Morgan:

Yep. Not just you as the company. I love it.

Well, let me transition a little bit because so far we’ve been talking about this whole idea of how marketing is playing a critical role in shaping not just cultures at a company, but society at large. 

But that was kind of a set up to another argument that we’re really going to be talking about here in a minute, which is, All right, but today most boards are made up of operation and finance people. And there was an interesting article I shared with you, the HP article where it was like, “All right, let’s look at the next CEO or where things are coming from”. And there really is this interesting notion where it’s like in the 90s, everything was all about that total quality leadership thing. And there was a real need for more operational leadership.

But if we’re looking at this future of, “Okay, marketing and creativity is really driving all these experiences and really driving beyond just trying to be more efficient”. Right? It’s more of like those relationships and how do you dig deeper? We want to set up this argument of saying, “Well then why hasn’t boards of directors kept up with where the changing needs of business are moving?” So we should have, rather than boards of directors made up of mostly operation and finance, how do we get more people who have more of a creative slant? Whether that’s a marketer, or a creative leader, or a design, or whatever that may be, how do we get more of them onto the board? So I’d love to hear your thoughts as I set up that argument.

Sandra Lopez:

Yeah. I mean listen, overnight supply chain officers are wanted in the board of director seat. Because we realized what happened with COVID, how supply chain affected businesses. Why can’t we have the conversation of marketing as a critical part of the organization? I always kind of laugh when a company is going through financial struggles, what gets cut first?

Adam Morgan:

Yep. Marketing.

Sandra Lopez:

Marketing.

Adam Morgan:

Yep.

Sandra Lopez:

Marketing and HR, which I think is the most fascinating thing. Great companies are built by great people, so you’re affecting your HR groups. And then marketing as a growth engine, yet you’re cutting your growth engine both helping attract customers and retain your customers and grow your customers. But you decide to cut that. 

So I challenge our industry, we need to up-level the conversation. We need to talk about marketing as a business, and the role in which we play. And arguably we need to probably change our vernacular. I mean in “performance marketing” we’re absolutely getting there, because for every dollar you can kind of get to the revenue. But I do think we, as a community, maybe need to change the language that we’re using when we engage with the C-level or our CFOs. It’s not viewed as that shiny 50-second commercial that goes in the Super Bowl, or considered “Oh, we’ll go to the marketing department that all they do is pretty PowerPoint slides.”

Absolutely not. We don’t do PowerPoint slides. Maybe the slides are an articulation of our value proposition that is enabling sales to go articulate why our product is better than our competition. Maybe that slide serves as a briefing document to make sure that when the COs out there talking to the annual shareholders is representing how we’re positioning the overall brand. 

I think we need to get into these healthy debates, and for the board of directors to start to realize how marketing drives growth. And I think until we have these conversations will executive recruiting firms that are looking to land people on board of directors, or the CEO that’s trying to look at their board of director compositions, would they consider or, “Hey, why don’t you consider going to hire a CMO or head of creative?” 

And I think we have work to do. We have work to do to articulate our role and the business impact that exists should we not be there. Now the supply chain officer saw their role like front and center, whether they’d like the attention or not, but they’re the ones who are now getting calls for board of director seats.

Adam Morgan:

Yeah. I agree with you. And it really is starting the conversation, because we’re not saying that we have not been included in the board of directors. No. Like CMOs are usually on the boards. That’s totally fair.

Sandra Lopez:

Yeah. Yeah.

Adam Morgan:

I think what we’re trying to say is if you look at the whole makeup of a board, it leans really heavily to operations in finance.

Sandra Lopez:

Yep.

Adam Morgan:

Or even legal counsel, and you need those roles. 

Sandra Lopez:

And policy now. Adam, I would say policy now because of data policy. Right? So people that run policy, but then usually it’s legal. They’re part of the composition of the board of directors now if you start to look at the new compositions that are starting to emerge.

Adam Morgan:

And maybe what I’m getting at to it, because I agree with that completely, it’s more of like if you look at how people have trained their brains over the years. Like if someone has trained their brains just to look at financial sheets or stats and data, that’s one thing. But the problems that companies are facing aren’t like, “Okay, how can we be more efficient?” It’s, “How am I going to address this huge human need of this problem that’s just come up in the last month. What do we do?” Right? And I know you can say, “Oh, we’ve got people that’ll help us make those decisions.” But I think what I’m really getting at is there is a difference inherently with someone who has trained themselves to focus on the customer and connect emotionally their whole careers, and really understand that empathy and putting themselves in their shoes and creating those experiences.

And so having more on the board that have those superpowers versus financial superpowers, that’s what we’re saying. Like let’s balance that out a little bit better. By the same token where you said, “We need to step up in our own departments” is true. Like we need to start to learn to speak better with finance and understand some of those other key components, because Wall Street is always going to come knocking and you need to be able to respond to that.

Sandra Lopez:

Yep.

Adam Morgan:

So I think that’s what I’ve often said to creative leaders is you need to learn to speak the business language. You need to learn to speak strategy and learn to speak finance. And a lot of people want to roll their eyes and ignore that. But I’m like, “No, no, no. The only way we’re ever going to get there is if you can speak that language, but then still bring your set of skills of looking at things through the customer lens. And looking at stories and experiences in a different way.” So there’s got to be a lot of growth on both sides to get there.

Sandra Lopez:

100% agree. And you’re talking about the creativity and just brought a point up is that, right now many individuals… We talk about diverse inclusion, oftentimes anchored on ethnicity. But diversity of inclusion the heart of it is about diversity of thought. So your point around when you look at the board of director compositions, it’s heavily financial and operations-driven. Wouldn’t you think about diversity of thought and bringing somebody, to your point, the creative person has been trained by its very nature to look at things radically different. And they’ve honed in that skill for several years.

So they have this muscle where maybe asking the question differently leads to a different strategic direction that the company wants to take. And so I think there’s a massive opportunity for creative directors, CMOs, to be part of the BOD and help shape the company. You can represent the customer, you’re representing our population, and having that voice and kind of influencing the company to do better and to do good.

Adam Morgan:

And you’d said earlier that we have a long way to go in that one of the audiences that we need to influence are current boards of directors and current CEOs. And I wholeheartedly agree that we absolutely need to make a case for it and start to have conversations like this to at least to get the conversation up there. And I think another audience that we probably need to look at are recruiters because I can guarantee when they’re looking for the next CEO or even CMO they’re only looking for a specific breed, and it does lean definitely towards metrics and numbers and finance. So how do we get that conversation going? 

I guess that’s the ask for this audience and beyond, start talking to recruiters. If you’re a recruiter, please consider other options for another position. And if you’re on a board of directors, maybe consider something like a chief experience officer, or bring someone on that’s a new role. Let’s just expand the board. There’s not like a finite number that has to be there. And bring in more voices or ideas or people who have that skill set of understanding humanity and emotions and experiences.

Sandra Lopez:

Yeah. You have the executive recruiting firms, you have the CEOs who have a significant influence of who they want in the board of director compositions, the BOD people, and then there’s the community that are seeking and identifying beyond executive recruiters. They’re actively looking for the next generation of BOD directors. 

For us — you, Adam, myself — we have to allocate time to articulate why this is important. And it’s going to take us kind of conditioning the market. These are our customers, right? Executive recruiters, the CEO, the other companies that are looking at BOD compositions. To educate so that maybe it’s not going to be us landing it, it’s going to be in the next generation of giving them a shot. 

I spend a lot of time, not only talking about me as a Latina and what I can do for BOD but me as a business marketer and what I can do to help drive growth. Or you can anchor on something that marketing is really known for, it’s like the digital transformation that we had to go go through. Everybody’s has to go through a digital transformation, and so the value that you can contribute there. 

So I always tell myself, this is just part of an additive part of my job, and it’s really to benefit society at large and maybe you and I are not going to land it, but the next generation will, if we keep on having a compelling argument to why this voice matters in the board of directors room.

Adam Morgan:

Oh, excellent. One last thing I wanted to bring up on that topic. We did some research this last fall, we interviewed 100s of creative leaders, across the nation and we just about careers and understanding what their next step would be and where they would go. And certainly there were plenty that were like, “No I see a ceiling, this is where it’s at.” But there was an interesting stat where a third of them had imagined or were planning on not just waiting for a position on a board of directors, but breaking off and doing some startup or they were the CEO.

And I’ve seen a lot of these creator as CEO or as founder of a new startup, because they’re understanding the market. They’re understanding customers and moving into a place where it’s a better customer experience. 

So here would be my one thing to current CEOs and boards. It’s better to get someone on your board now who understands that rather than have other company completely disrupt you because the creative leader has moved off and started a better experience with a better relationship. So better to do it now, rather than lose to a competitor. That’s my thought. It’s just like, let’s get someone on the board and have them be a partner arm and arm with you.

Sandra Lopez:

I meant to that. I agree. I 100% percent agree with that.

Adam Morgan:

Oh, excellent.  Any last advice you’d have to help other marketers or other people to help start these conversations or continue pushing better experiences for all companies and all culture?

Sandra Lopez:

I mean, I think Adam Adobe, you guys have a conference, Microsoft, we have a conference, the advertising industry has a conference. Why don’t we look at ourselves first and challenge the content, the programming, and talk about the role of marketing playing at a larger level and challenge the industry conferences? It has to start with us, because if we’re not talking about it, then obviously why would the BOD and why would these executive recruiters talk about it? 

So I would challenge us for the coming closing out this year and going into next year, let’s get this topic on the programming, similar to how maybe five years ago we got diverse inclusion as part of a topic that you see it in every single conference.

Adam Morgan:

Yep.

Sandra Lopez:

Let’s get marketing as a business and why we deserve a BOD seat within our industry. And let’s see how far we can go collectively together with our tribe to land some of our talented community, art directors, creative director, CMOs on BOD seats.

Adam Morgan:

Wow. That’s a great suggestion. I love it. We’ve got the data. I’m sure we’ve got plenty of-

Sandra Lopez:

We’ve got the data. We’ve got the conference. So Adam, if anything, you and I are going to take it on and what’s going to start with us, that’s oftentimes until people — change starts with one, and get the flywheel going. So we will talk about this offline and look at our upcoming conferences and see how we can make this happen. And Adam, if I can make it happen on my side, I will actually invite you and let’s continue the dialogue, let’s track the changes and see if we can drive change together.

Adam Morgan:

That’s brilliant. Well, thank you so much. So as we’re ending here, let our viewers know and listeners, how do they follow you or your career? Where can they find you? What channels are you on? Where do we learn more about you?

Sandra Lopez:

Yes, marketers, I think we should be on all channels. So you can find me anywhere and everywhere. I’m on LinkedIn, probably the zero one from a business perspective, I’m on Instagram, I’m on Twitter, I’m on TikTok, I’m on snap, learning them all. And I’m on email and I’m on phone. So if you want to connect with me, there’s multiple ways start with LinkedIn and we can go from there, and look forward to continue in the dialogue with the community at large.

Adam Morgan:

Excellent. Thank you so much. And as always, you can always find us at realcreativeleadership.com. We have a full catalog of past shows and sessions and episodes that you can go back and watch. You can always find and follow Real Creative Leadership on all the major channels like you said, every single one of them. Well, at least I know for sure, we’re mostly on LinkedIn, Twitter, and I think those are the two most common. You can also find me my website, adamwmorgan.com or on LinkedIn. And you can learn more about The Stoke Group, the digital marketing and content agency that produces this show at thestokegroup.com. We’d love to invite you all to connect or engage with us in some way. We just set up this big idea of go out to your events people, talk to them about getting this topic on the agenda, you can like or share this episode with others to get things moving, post a comment or question on social media. We love hearing from all of you. So thanks again for listening and we’ll see you on our next episode.